Metagame - SV RU Metagame Discussion (Iron Leaves banned, see post #230) (2024)

I really need to try other things - why did we get a whole new tier a month before getting a whole new tier - but I wanted to focus on the obvious one (Hoopa) at first. Because cmon, of all the things that ever dropped to us idt I have been as shocked by one in that whole decade ROFL.

Anyway, funny team here. I'll just talk about these things first and when I make other stuff I'll elaborate, especially on Mew Enamorus Zarude that I really do want to try:

- Yeah Hoopa is extremely funny in a lot of the wrong ways. It's also extremely customisable though I think starting from Choice Band is an obvious call with Hyperspace Fury being so silly strong. It's definitely on the frail side physically, but I really don't think it matters that much. U-turn can be easily mitigated with tera and ya, you use tera, but if you get two kos that did its job. Special wise though its really really bulky and fairly easy to get into the field, moreso if you use it with some of the wish mons. The team I had in mind here was built in a way that I wouldn't have the ability to take hits, but everything else has momentum and ways to benefit Hoopa's breaking. It's definitely been fine imo, but its damage is way not. (Sidenote, I really don't see how it not being banned is "emblematic of a tier that is in shambles after a DLC2 drop-fest." It's just there's no reason to rush and give all people on Council the time to play and establish a first slate. Hoopa being gone in a new World Record doesn't matter for anything.)

- Hersculegion is everything Masculegion wanted to be but couldn't (kinda like me actually), but... I do wonder if its too strong? What we have that resist both stabs and is actually used:

- Chesnaught
- Crawdaunt
- Cyclizar
- Zarude

Let's get Crawdaunt of the list obviously, because Specs Surf does 80 minimum. Chesnaught without spd will be 2hkoed by surf into tera surf, while losing to two with one spikes up, or rocks if it's helmet. Max HP Cyclizar does not get koed from Ice Beam and takes around 44 from surf, so it can pivot, but it cannot ko hersculegion EVEN with max attack power whip. Zarude can, but also takes around 44 from stabs, and might not run recovery. Point is, you can hit them with ice beam, but you don't need to, and only Cyclizar due to regen isn't in an absolutely dreadful spot, but again, its the one thing on the list that cannot ko it. Then, what else? You have Umbreon, but that wants phys def to handle Hoopa better right now, and even then Surf does 44 to max spd. Chansey? Can't hit you, takes hazards and is fairly easy to grab momentum on. Registeel lost everything good, and also takes 44. Because everything does it seems.

Then yeah, its slow. Kinda, it is. But so is Hoopa, and it has a much better typing. Its bulk is not entirely terrible either due to high base HP. For example, Raikou's Thunderbolt has a 37.5% chance to ko from full. CM Mew that teras outside of its ghost weakness can still lose the 1v1 to Shadow Ball despite Draining Kiss. But then there's rain. Swift Swim solves the speed issue for a few turns, giving its water move an added bonus you just took out. But you can still run Adaptability on rain!! That effectively requires you to run a water absorb mon because like:

- 252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Tera Water Basculegion-F Surf vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 292-344 (41.4 - 48.8%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes
252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Tera Water Basculegion-F Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Milotic in Rain: 140-166 (35.5 - 42.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO. That one is almost impressive once you realize you need Mirror Coat to do something and that means you can't check the Barraskewda whatsoever now.

Anyway, I'm saying a ton about this but there's so much rewards from using it that the downsides are very w/e to me. Its easy to use, easy to play agro with, resists a ton of the needed priorities in this tier and retaliate with... ease. I definitely think so far, that its better than Crawdaunt, Conkeldurr and Mamoswine. Maybe Enamorus too but it's not really similar I suppose.

- Onto way less silly stuff, Cobalion and Flygon are basically old reliables. There's genuinely not much to say, this Cobalion set is a classic, it gets up rocks, volts on stuff, its great. Can we PLEASE keep it for once. Flygon losing roost, defog and toxic makes its defensive niche very hard to replicate, but as a fairly easy to spam offensive-ish mon... It's still Flygon, so I eventually expect it to be used here and in tours. As for why Draco Meteor, look I played on ladder you think I want to lose to Adamant Cloyster cmon now im not new

- Speaking of old reliables. Slither Wing seems in a very similar place to when it dropped to me. Extremely offensive meta that makes you really want First Impression, it's difficult to ko, has a plethora of moves that can be helpful. Again more of the same, but I mostly saw it on sun and its a lot more than just a mon for that archetype.

- Ampha said Whimsicott was bad, but. BUT. I am a believer, like... pretty much always actually. I think the problem with Whimsicott is that people tend to build with roles in mind, and then what mons in the metagame fit those roles better for the team.

Here's the issue, Whimsicott's role is being a Whimsicott. And in most situations, that's not what you want. It's quite frail, not very strong, you let a lot of things in pretty freely. But it has legit one of the best encores in the tier. It's a fast fairy type in a low tier that doesn't get many of those, especially one with uturn. It has SOME resists, which would be inadequate on bulkier teams, but clearly I wasn't going for that. And the kicker: Tailwind. Extremely situational in singles most of the time, sure. But with Hoopa and Hersculegion, it's been very useful as it solves the few issues I had with these breakers. Makes it way easier to counterplay weather and speed boosting offences too. I do agree that it's not something you will consistently see, but I don't think it needs to be that at all. And nothing else I could find would fit what I wanted in that last slot so well.

Metagame - SV RU Metagame Discussion (Iron Leaves banned, see post #230) (2024)
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